Am I a feminist? Well .....

                                                                   

Ok, today is my birthday and I just have to write this.  I have hardly had time to blog on anyone of my  7 blogs over the past year.  (yes I have 7 blogs I keep up, or try to). Plus I try to write articles for several journals, so I do stay busy writing!  Blogging has not been on the top of my to do list to do like it use to be!

Out of all of the facebook friends I have, when I read your posts, I might not always agree with you, and if I do disagree I often will not post a response.  You have the right to your opinion.  When you post YOUR opinion on YOUR page it does not give me the right to argue with you on YOUR page.

 I expect that same respect on MY page. I am totally ok with discussions, no problem unless it gets ugly.  It is my page, I have the right to my opinion on my own page.  And on your page it is your page, you have the right to your opinion.  With that said, I welcome others opinions, will discuss them, but will keep my opinion if I feel strong about something.
Then sometimes....I just have to open my mouth on my page or yours....
As I did yesterday....

Someone posted something about men treating women better...(I am purposefully not going into exact details here so I do not have any identifying comments of the person or persons).

I  continued to read the discussion, and one person posted about rape --on this persons page -and a mans reaction/responsibility.  Next, -a man posted back and said: that rape ---is the fault of both the man and the woman.  His reasoning: that men are visually stimulated, thus the woman holds some responsibility in how she dresses.  He went on to say that most women do not dress sluttish, (wasn't that nice of him to say...).  

The page 'owner' did not ever respond to any of these comments.

The final comment this guy said in his long assessment of how a woman has responsibility in her rape, was "well rape should never happen". It was like that final comment somehow took away the fact that he already said that a woman has to take some of the responsibility for the rape because of how she was dressed and thus since a man is visually stimulated. I took him to mean that this woman,  *sluttish* or not, was responsible for her dress and if it was not modest, it could cause a man to get excited and thus rape her, and then she is responsible, not just him.

I had to say something.  I just had to open my mouth...

I responded with the following to his original comment:

Yes, rape is the mans fault. As a man, control your actions-

EVEN if a woman is not dressed modestly. The man might look on her and lust but it does NOT give that man permission to act. Stop putting mans actions of sexual aggression and sin onto the victim.

He responded with: (and notice he cant even spell my name correctly even with it right in front of him) 

Irena, That's not what I said. I said men are VISUALLY stimulated. By what they see. If a woman is naked, do you really think the woman had no part in the mans reaction ? Come on. And did you even read the last line of my first comment? If you think how a woman dresses doesn't effect how a man looks at her, you are probably a feminist.

Remember his last line of his first comment was that basically no one should get raped, but that comment was buried in his other one, that a woman should also be responsible. 

I guess I am a feminist.  

Definition of a feminist: Someone who supports feminism. 

Definition of feminism:  The belief that women are and should be treated as potential intellectual equals and social equals to men. These people can be either male or female human beings, although the ideology is commonly (and perhaps falsely) associated mainly with women. Feminism is the belief that all people are entitled to the same civil rights and liberties and can be intellectual equals regardless of gender. However, you should still hold the door for a feminist; this is known as respect or politeness and need have nothing whatever to do with gender discrimination.

I do know that some feminist take this further, There seems to be a sort of 'degrees' of/in feminism, Meaning different beliefs- but the basic belief is the above.  

So if you believe that a woman should be treated equally, another words given the same pay if doing the same job, given the same rights in this society, You are by definition a feminist. Wow, did you not know that? 

The word feminist takes on a different meaning depending on who you are.  Sort of like the word evolve. 

Many Christians do not like the word 'evolve'.  That is because they associate it with evolution, and since most do not agree with that theory they throw the whole thing-- including the word--out. 

The word evolve, means changing. Actual definition is: the process by which different kinds of living organisms are thought to have developed and diversified from earlier forms during the history of the earth 

Since some believers do not agree with evolution, They want to the throw the whole word and process out, That's nuts. We can not throw the word out just because we do not agree with evolution. Many animals, and things are always changing, adapting to their environment, Thus evolution is happening all around us and will continue to happen.  That is life, and how the creator has made things to happen.  We also evolve as people.  We are changing, we change in our beliefs and how we function. We evolve to being older-as we age. Evolution is all around us (and for some of us as we age, around us more than we like! )

So my point of all of that is to say, feminist-or being a feminist might not be all bad. Many of us are or would fit in the category of the definition of a feminist. That does not mean you HAVE to believe and agree with ALL they support. 

 Now I can hear some of you saying: well I can not support them at all based on this or that part of their belief.  I am not saying you HAVE to support them, I do not fully support the *cause*, but by definition, I do support equal rights, equal pay, and fair treatment. So by that, if based on that only,I guess I am a feminist. You are too if you support those things. It does not mean we have *joined the cause* of feminism. I do not call myself a feminist.  I never have.  

So back to this guy....

So my husband and I had just gotten to the campground and we sat there in the car as I read to him this exchange.  I was frustrated. Why do some men, and this one was claiming to be a believer like I am, (which actually makes me more frustrated with him that he is responding this way because I hold him to a higher standard), why do some men (people) think they can blame others for their sins? We all sin, and when I do sin, it is MY responsibility, I am at fault, I can not blame others for my actions. 

Why do some men (people) think that a mans action of rape is NOT their responsibility? Again I said THEIR ACTION OF RAPE. Its their action.  Their responsibility. 

So my husband and I sat there in the car talking, as people walked past us...i pointed to two young women and said even if they are naked walking past us it does not give you the right to act on the urge of excitement and rape them.  He agreed and he said the following and I put that up on the discussion. 

"Even a naked woman running past you, does not give you permission as a man to rape her. " my husband said in response to your comments. He said more too, but I am not gonna get into a war with you and your name calling.

Then he (my husband) gave several more examples of how people could be dressed or and have someone respond, I did not share all of them on the page and will not here either, but they were good examples. 

The next example was of a child, what about a child dressed in a bathing suit?  (as we saw a family headed to the pool and the little girl was in her swim suit walking past us) He said this and I posted this to the discussion. 

By your definition: if a child is dressed in something that is not modest, a pedifile (sp?) who rapes the child, is not the only responsible one-that child is also responsible. (Again comment from my husband).
I share his view. If this view makes me a feminist in your opinion , then fine.

The guy did not say anything else, just removed his posts. Good. Hopefully he got it. But I doubt it.  If he did and realized he was wrong in his thinking, he would have responded back or should have responded back with an apology.  He did not. So I doubt he even cared.  

I KNOW that men are visual, and are stimulated by just 'seeing' things, but they are responsible if they act or not. 

I was proud of my husband. His responses were right on. Him and I discussed many more things about this but I will stop now.  I guess I have went on enough.  If you do not agree with me, and especially if you are a man, I only ask you to really really thing about your response before you actually respond. I welcome discussion. 

But first I leave you with this thought:  

"Would you say the same thing about your daughter if she was raped? Would you say: well daughter, you should have not been dressed like that you know men are visually stimulated and so you stimulated that man by how you were dressed and that is why it is now your responsibility for what happened to you." 

 I think not.

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How hard my hubby works....

Ok So I was thinking about something today. My hubby has worked so much this past year, up to 74 hours a week, Yes that much. That is crazy! (since the beginning of April).  

Now let me say to those of you who have lost a spouse, child, loved one to death-I am in no way comparing what we are going thru to the same type of situation that you have went through. I fully get that difference.

Some people say, well he must be making a lot of money. It is not about money -when you work this much, you go into a higher tax bracket, and with no children at home, we really do not have anything to claim, so he is working to pay a lot of taxes. that helps those who are on welfare, who are on disability, or the elderly- We are helping a lot of people by paying a lot of taxes. I do not mind doing my part, but wow! This is a bit more than we want to do.  

He is older than many who work at the same place. I get so tired of what he as to go thru, he works so hard. Then he tells of those who are younger (20's or 30's) who come to work for one day or at the most a week, then leave because (put on a winy voice here) it's too hard of work... Scott comes home barely able to walk, in so much pain in his back and hips. Yet he keeps going (again, no one complain that I am comparing him to you or to someone you know- because I am NOT, just stating facts here). We could use a chiropractor living here full time!

I tell people all the time when they say they need a job, well go to this place. If you can pass the drug test, you can get a job. But they don't want to, because its a factory and they want a more important job, they don't want to work that hard....wine ...wine...wine. I say, work where you can, and if you can change jobs later, great. But WORK where you can! The bible talks about you working or you do not eat. It is ok to work where you can get a job, it is noble, it is biblical. It is the right thing to do.

Anyway, Scott has been working up to 12 hours a day, 6 days a week. Some have been only 10 hour days, but mostly 12 hour days. He has been exhausted.

So this has been going on for 46 weeks now. OF those 46 weeks, 3 weeks he has not worked total. So out of the remaining weeks he works 74 hours a week out of a total of 168 hours a week, he is at the job 72-74 of those. That means he is not at the job out of 168 hours a week 94 hours. Of those 94 hours, he sleeps for 55 of them. That leaves a remaining of 39 hours. Of those 39 hours, 13 are spent driving to and from work, eating, bathing, and getting ready to go to work. That leaves 26 hours a week. Of those 26 hours a week, 17 of them are on a Sunday. (the only day he is off each week). That leaves 9 hours. Those 9 hours are divided by 6 and that tells you how much time each day he has to himself-or to me. That is 1.5 hours a day that is for him and me, or just for him.

He got nothing done at home all of this time. Also, of that 1.5 hours a day for 6 of the 7 days, if I am not home yet from doing appointments, or at a birth, then we miss seeing each other that day. Same thing on the sunday-even though he has more time that day, if I am gone to a birth, we do not see each other.

~So for the total 46 weeks, there were a total of 168 hours a week x 46 = 7728 hours.

~For the total 46 weeks, there were a total out of 7728 hours 3182 hours were spent at work.

~For the total 46 weeks, there were a total out of the remaining 4546 hours and 2530 of those were spent   sleeping (although on sundays he often also slept extra but I have not included that in the count).

~For the 46 hours, there were a total of remaining 2016 hours left and of those 598 were spent driving, 

bathing, eating, getting ready for work, doing chores etc.

~For the remaining 1418 more hours that were 'his' time, and also time to spend with me.

I know, some of you might be thinking why figure that out. Because I was curious that's why. I think I did the math correctly, if not, I don't need you correcting me. So just don't. I am doing this as a record of our lives-blogging, for our children, grandchildren, and you are just invited along ---no reason.

That is it.

Ireena

Judgement-- and the Duggars....

This past couple of weeks there has been on the news a LOT of articles about Josh Duggar.

I held back from commenting on them, or sharing any of them.  I made a choice to not become involved in the judgement.  I know that some talked and shared the articles, I am not judging you for doing that, but I want to gently ask:  Did you have all of the facts first? Often when stuff comes out, the whole story is not out there. We need to learn to wait, as believers, until the whole story is there -but remember, GOD already knows the whole story-and if HE wills it, HE will allow that truth to come out, if the truth does not, GOD may be testing us- HIS children-how we will handle part of a story...

I saw on several talk shows people talking about them, and I have to say: shame on all of them.  If you believed everything that they said, you would have to believe that the family hid all of this,  trying to cover it all up.  They (the media) claimed the following:
~that the family did not seek professional care
~They tried to cover it up
~they went to a police friend, not actual police, for help from the police. (and this 'friend' later went to prison for child molestation)
~They only sought help from their pastor
~they only tried to protect Josh, not the girls

This is just a few of the claims. So lets look at each one of those:
They did not seek professional care: Not true, the parents said all received professional care. From professionals. Therapists.
They tried to cover it up: Actually, they did not cover it up.  But lets look at this one after we have looked at all of the others.
They went to a police friend, not actual police, for help from the police. (and this 'friend' later went to prison for child molestation): no, the parents said in the interview that they along with Josh, walked into the police department, and they were (assigned) the policeman (who later went to prison) to speak with.  They were not friends.
They only sought help from their pastor: Why would you think that they would not seek help from a spiritual advisor in their lives? Come on!  If something horrible is happening in your life, would you also not go to your pastor (if you attend church)?
They only tried to protect their son, not the girls: They right away within in the family- protected the girls.  Many of their  policies in this family are the same ones that their haters do not like ---for example: with the younger children the family rule is: no bathing together, boys and girls, even the toddlers, never sleep together, even toddlers, mixed boys and girls, if a little girl in the family needs help with getting bathed, dressed or  going to the bathroom, they go with another girl, same for boys. They do not allow alone time to protect the younger children.  They told the girls, got them professional help/counseling, (the girls did not even know this had happened since it had happened while they were asleep).  So actually, they could have chosen to hide it from the girls, but they did not.

Also: when they went to the police, they did not know if Josh would be arrested or not, did not know if this would start a investigation from CPS on the family or not.  They were vulnerable -open and worked with who they needed to.  Once all was done, the case was sealed (since ALL involved were juveniles) and forgiveness began within the family.  That is, until someone in the police department all these years later, decided to illegally open the file of a sealed by the court's case on a juvenile, and illegally allow that file -out to the public.

Remember: 
The son, Josh, did come to the parents himself (which speaks loudly to me, ) yes he did this, fondling, on top of the clothing, (some would say that does not make a difference and I get that), but he felt such guilt that he went and told on himself.  That speaks  volumes as to how he was raised and that his heart was still soft enough for YHWH to work and make the changes in this young boy (Yes a BOY) before he became a man and continued on this path!

Josh also paid for his own therapy, and bills related to this stuff. He had to use his own money that he had raised, so the parents did NOT bail him out of  the financial cost to help him.  I think that is good.  More ways he took responsibility.

SO why does this get me so angry?  Because I went thru something when I was young.
When I was about 14, I awoke to (more than once that this happened and I will not say where I was at, but I was NOT at my own home) so I woke up in the middle of the night to find my breasts OUT of the clothing I had on, and some young guy (same age as me) fondling my breasts. He backed away from me, and I screamed. He said he was only out there to check on me and his sister (we were in a camper sleeping).
Bull shit.
His sister did not believe me.   I kept saying no, he was feeling me up. He lied and tried to say I was uncovered, he was trying to cover me up, what ever-no I was not, YOU did that to me!! 
Anyway, I was NOT believed. I tired to argue but no one was listening, and I know that he was scared he would get into a lot of trouble (since he was in trouble for other things).  I was friends with this girl, and other times we were in her room when I would spend the night, and I woke up with this guy standing over me.  We finally locked the bedroom door.  Yes some will say, why did you stay there again?  She was my friend, but sad I guess not enough friend to believe me.

BUT, I  NEVER EVER forgot this.  This person is still in my life (will not say how and why, trying not to name the person).  BUT I watch close, I never allowed my own daughters to visit at his home with his daughter, not over night.  I still do not trust him. He has yet to be man enough to come to me and apologize.  No one has asked my forgiveness for violating ME.

 What this guy did to me, is the VERY same thing Josh did to his sisters.  Only my breasts were exposed by the guy who touched me-he touched me skin to skin. Yuk! I am ever grossed out that he saw me and touched me.  It makes me sick.  It makes me sick to see him and if he talks to me at all.  I can't stand it.  Knowing he did this and never has said he was sorry, never asked for forgiveness, and those who knew-basically called me a liar.  Yes, I have forgiven-because I have to.  If not it destroys me.  BUT I have not forgotten.  I will not forget being molested. I will never trust this person. Never.

THIS IS MY STORY TO TELL, it is NOT anyone else's story.  If I name him, it is MY choice, not someone else's.
I was a VICTIM.
He is not.
He is the one doing wrong.
I was not.
I was, am the VICTIM.
Me.
Again, I am the victim., NOT him. 

Now, again, if the victim chooses to tell their story, fine, if they choose not to-fine.  It is always the victim's story to tell.

This is why I am so frustrated with what has happened with the Duggars.  It is the girls story to tell. They were juveniles, and their records are suppose to be kept sealed.  Protected.  See that word folks?  PROTECTED (In case you missed it before).

Now they are being forced to relive this, becoming a Victim again-all across the country and around the world and it was NOT their choice!

Yes, we serve a big GOD and HE ultimately has a plan which sometimes means allowing bad things to happen to good people, I get that. He can turn this into something good.  He can use it. I get that.  But was it in HIS plan or did some ungodly police officer that had an agenda against the family, purposely turn over the sealed document? That sounds like the enemy working in that ungodly police officer--that is what it sounds like to me. I will call it as it looks.  So again, Yes, GOD CAN use it for HIS good, but the enemy is the one that was at work here.

REMEMBER:  the family dealt with this back then, completely. What right do we have to hear about it if GOD has worked with the family and dealt with it already?
The Enemy is using it now.

 I think that the person  in the police department who leaked this information, who opened sealed documents of Juveniles, should be punished.  Her name should be out there for the public.
Shame shame shame on her!

And shame on everyone who falsely judged the Duggar family before hearing all of the facts. Many, even 'christians' who hate the Duggars, or hate the type of homeschooling stuff they use (bill gothard) allow that to place a veil over their eyes when looking at this and what has happened.  Come on! How awful!  I might not like the church you are in, but I do not wish you a painful life or problems on you.

I have been misjudged.  By a church full of people that were suppose to be my family.  I did not even get a chance to really talk to them all, (when you have been arrested, you can not speak about everything, not in full and I did not get to in full talk to anyone but my husband and  attorney).  So still to this day, I am outed by this church-still to this day-they think they have the whole story, but they do not.  They judged me, they judged me wrong.

I am past that now in my life, but I say this to explain the following:  I will always remember those who supported me, not knowing the whole truth.  I will NEVER forget any of you. You made a (correct) choice to hold your judgement back until you had the full story. (it took years) but you were following YHWH and what HE told you to do.  I thank you.  I will always remember those people.

Christians, we have to do the same for the Duggars.  Please please hold your judgement until ALL facts are in. Remember also: what would you do if your 13-14 year old son came to you and said this:  I just felt my sister's breast?  some say, well it happened once, so how could the parents allow it to happen again?
Do any of you parents sit up all night at your daughters bedside watching so no one comes into the room?  Do you put a lock on the outside of the sons door, thus now taking a risk to get charged with restraining your son unsafely, (in case of a fire)?   Come on, we as a nation and the 'church' is so quick to judge others.  

Put yourself in the parents shoes, and be careful not to quickly come to a judgemental attitude. What an awful spot for a parent to be in.  No one knows until you are actually there what you would do...so be careful, lest the same befalls onto you or worse...

There but the Grace of GOD go I.....

He who is without sin, cast the first stone....

A Lot Of Updates!~

So it has been since May this last year since I have written anything on any one of my blogs!  Wow, I guess I have been busy.  So here are some of my updates:

I continued from May until fall, dealing with the legal battles in the county.  They are extremely slow in this county (that was said by other county's actually, not just me) and I was also told that they were hanging onto my case because of the other midwife.  So there I sat, waiting for a number of years for them to just 'let it go'. 

Finally-they did.  The case was dismissed.  It is done. There is so much more to all of this too, but nothing I will put into writing at this time. sorry.. 
in time...
maybe I will write a book...

So by the fall, it was all done. FINALLY!

    My husband and I are trying to get the house ready for sale.  We want to move.  Getting the house ready is taking more time than we like, just because we are a bit older...we have a roof to replace,  new garage doors, new doors for our walk out basement area, a front garden that is a mess of weeds to untangle, new front steps and walkway to finish.  Its tough when you're older!  Just a word of warning to everyone-get your work done before you age!

We also bought a camper this past late winter/early spring. Rented a permanent spot at a local campground, and enjoyed relaxing times there.  Below are a few photos.  

The other new stuff in my life-I had a mild heart attack(?) issue last december.  Thankfully nothing was 'clogged' it was all stress related (go figure why I had stress in MY life!) 

Well, enjoy the photos below! 

the camp fire...a work in progress,  it will be larger next year! 

Working on the deck

enjoying the family hammock 

enjoying the pool, with out the work of maintaining the pool!  :)

Now, this photo has a story:  (see below)

Depression: Despair: and How to Help Someone, and NOT Make it Worse!

Ugg.
Yes that is what I say-Ugg.  This society judges people when they are depressed, or at the end of their 'rope'.  I have seen it and over the past 2 and 1/2 years personally having experienced it more often than a human being should.
Then there are those who make it worse because of their judgement which is often just awful!
No one knows how hard a person tries, no one knows what is going thru a persons mind as they struggle with life's ups and downs.  And remember, no one knows when their comments and their attitude or disrespect or lies will be the thing that pushes a person over the edge.  Have you ever 'heard' a person who has cried out for help? When they do-- what do you do?  How do you act? What do you do?  What do you say? Becoming angry with them for having a weak moment and wanting to give up, does not do them any good.  Telling them to get over it does not do any good.  Telling them that others have it worse off than they do does not do any good.  Telling them that it will eventually get better  does not do them any good.    You can always compare their life and someone elses trying to make them feel better, but why? Does that serve a positive purpose?  Does that build up the person who is struggling or does it just pile more guilt onto them?  Ya maybe there is someone going thru something much worse, most likely there is-- at least somewhere in this world.  But comparing that persons troubles to what the person you are talking with -trying to help-that comparing does NOT help them it actually causes more damage.
Here is how to really help a person in trouble:
GO over to their home, talk to them, do their dishes, sweep their floors, help with a payment on a bill, take a casserole, fill their autos gas tank, wash their car, weed their garden, mow their lawn, take them out for dinner.....all things to help them, not create more stress.

Then we have the person who wants to quote scriptures- ones that only pile on the guilt.  Ok, as a believer I do know that YHWH has scripture enough to help with everything in life, but sometimes, you need to leave this job to the HOLY SPIRIT-and not try to be the persons holy spirit-- GOD/YHWH is a big god and can handle HIS job just fine!

Are you someone who is telling this person they are in sin, as you sit there smoking, or eating too much, or are overweight, or cuss all the time, or look at half dressed women on line or in magazines, or watch shows or movies that are not GODLY or uplifting, watch 'cut them up' horror movies, or speed when driving....I can go on and but basically I am saying: pull the beam out of your own eye first folks. Don't tell the person that they are in sin to be depressed or feel like they want to give up on life, when you are doing any of the above listed, or other things.
Ok, I am done 'preaching".

They Will Know Us By Our Fruit.....

Well I had an interesting week.  Something happened this week that allowed GOD to show me how sad some HIS people really are acting and how messed up the "church" really is.  I knew it was, but still it is always sad to 'see' evidence of it again.

Two different things took place, yet they were alike in many ways.  Both took place on the web-on facebook.

 Social media-it has become a tool that we use daily; most of us do-to communicate with others.  I use it to communicate with my children, relatives, friends in this area and other states and even some clients.

I almost never post anything about my 'job' on there, but I do post things from others about birth.  I post scriptures, I post photos, I comment and share things that I find interesting, and I use it to do research-only because it is so widely used now.

So the beginning of the week, a birthy friend posted something related to abortion-a question and then her opinion.  This friend -I do consider to be a friend, her views are not the same as mine when it comes to religion and abortion.  But I still consider her to be a friend.  We have gone to a midwifery conference and shared the expense of a room.  I am not like some christians who refuse to even speak with those who do not share the same views.   (how can we show them the true love of YHWH when we do not even speak with those who do not share our belief?)

So I posted on her page after her post about abortion, that I could not agree and I posted why-sharing a scripture that says:
11 Rescue those who are unjustly sentenced to death; don't stand back and let them die. 12Don't try to avoid responsibility by saying you didn't know about it. For God knows all hearts, and he sees you. He keeps watch over your soul, and he knows you knew! And he will judge all people according to what they have done.  Proverbs 24:11-12

Out of all the commenters on this thread, only one was very rude-saying that we needed to "be real" and went on to complain about those of us who do not want women to have the freedom of choice are not real and yada yada yada.  So I did point out what I would do, and also what I have done, and what I do for mission work (I began a not-for-profit ministry that serves in the U.S. to many, and I have done mission work since 1992, from 1 to 5 trips a year) so basically I was not trying to toot my own horn, but say hey! I DO work for many, and the lower income, poor, homeless, etc-is what I work with! I also said (and many believers will feel I am wrong) but the government and myself do not have the right to tell you that you can  not have an abortion.  I think the government has too much control, and even though I feel to my deepest inner being, how wrong abortion is, I can not restrict a person's choice.  So how do i rescue those who are unjustly sentenced to death?  (I will address that on another blog soon!)

             The freedom to post our opinions, even if opposing-is one thing this country is about.

                                                                 Freedom.

So later in the week, someone else, totally different page-different poster---posted something that I found to be very rude.

  I waited 3 hours before posting my thoughts, because I wanted to pray about what I posted, (not that I did not pray before I posted before on the other site too) --but since this person claimed to be a believer-I knew I would be handling this person differently, as this person should know the scriptures

-here is what was originally posted:
"someone that flips hamburgers and drops fries into grease does need to have their pay changed............. to 50 cents and hour "  (typos are the poster)

Others responded at first, and then I posted this:
"Are you meaning that the employees do not deserve to be paid more than 50 cents an hour?"  
(because at first I read it wrong, and thought the poster was referring to the corporate level, not the 'little' workers- and I was not the only person who read the original post wrong, one of my sons who had posted before me -had read his post incorrectly too, thinking the same thing.)

This person responded again, saying  unskilled workers=unskilled pay.  (and said more too)

I responded:  "So underpaying them at 50 cents an hour like you said above is ok to do?  Im sorry, but I have a different opinion. I believe we are to pay a fare wage.  They can protest, they can ask for more, and just because they do-I do not believe that as a believer of YHWH it is ok to reduce their pay to 50 cents.  my opinion. " (typos mine)

The original poster then said: "The 50 cents was obviously sarcasm but anything over 5 dollars an hour that a trained monkey can do for free is too much. Yes monkeys can be trained to flip burgers for free..."

All I could say at that time was wow.  This person professes to be a believer, and was acting like this on facebook?  Again, freedom of speech allows this -but as a believer, I think we have to try to do better.

 I am not perfect, by no means, we all fail, I have many times, but when it is pointed out  to you how you are behaving, would you change, apologize? I would think so, but no-this person did not.

Proverbs 25:12 says: Valid criticism is as treasured by the one who heeds it as jewelry made from finest gold. 

A number of people tried to discuss this, telling this poster that they (using "they" so you do not know if the poster was male or female as to avoid identifying the person)  --were being rude and unreasonable but this person would not hear it.  I thought, really?  YHWH has a plan for how we are to treat others, including so called unskilled workers.  We are to pay a fair wage,  (GODs word says so) and HE has guidelines as to how we are to treat the workers!

1 Timothy 5:18

English Standard Version (ESV)

18 For the Scripture says, “You shall not muzzle an ox when it treads out the grain,” and, “The laborer deserves his wages.”

I put up the following scriptures to try to show the person what YHWH says:

Deuteronomy 15:7

“If there is a poor man among your brothers in any of the towns of the land that the LORD your God is giving you, do not be hardhearted or tightfisted toward your poor brother.”

Psalm 82:3-4

"Defend the weak and the fatherless; uphold the cause of the poor and the oppressed. Rescue the weak and the needy; deliver them from the hand of the wicked."

Proverbs 31:8-9

“Speak up for those who cannot speak for themselves, for the rights of all who are destitute. Speak up and judge fairly; defend the rights of the poor and needy.”

Jeremiah 22:13

“Woe to him who builds his palace by unrighteousness, his upper rooms by injustice, making his countrymen work for nothing, not paying them for their labor.?"

Proverbs 14:31

“He who oppresses the poor shows contempt for their Maker, but whoever is kind to the needy honors God.”

 I did not put up as many scriptures that there are out there, but tried to put a number of them up so I hopefully could show this person what YHWH/GOD had to say about it.  

 The posts were then all removed, so I thought, yes, this person has thought about the whole thing and removed it.  Maybe the LORD GOD YHWH has spoken to this person's heart. 

No, the next post was put up saying offensive things too, and when this person was questioned again by my daughter--because she was offended by this persons posts, her posts were removed.  She then posted the same thing, but again-removed.  Anything that was not lining up with how this person felt was removed.  Scripture was removed.  But by other posts, I noticed that the one scripture that this person seems to like is -how to judge others.  That tells the heart of the person.  Only judgement is ok.  

We can only judge when we judge thru YHWH/YAHWEH's eyes and HIS word as a guide to judge.  ALL of HIS word, not just here and there pieces!

 Well the story that YHWH brought to my mind when seeing all of this happening was the one about the money changers and how angry YESHUA became when HE went into the outer courts and saw how the poor were being treated by those selling to them---HE overturned the money changers tables.  Wow! that is when I see our LORD becoming angry, with those who were taking advantage of the poor-HE was not angry with the poor, but those who were taking advantage of them.  Not paying a fair wage is also taking advantage of the poor.  So why does this person not see that in the scriptures?  

Because many people who claim to be a believer, pick and choose what they want to believe in the scriptures.  Confusing.  

But YHWH /GOD says we will know them by their fruits-that means your actions will speak loudly to others.  

Fast forward to after several posts by others, and the scriptures I posted, and my daughter trying to talk with this person privately, since she was so hurt/offended-she reached out to this person privately---although scripture says this: 

23 So if when you are offering your gift at the altar you there remember that your brother has any [grievance] against you,

24 Leave your gift at the altar and go. First make peace with your brother, and then come back and present your gift.

25 Come to terms quickly with your accuser while you are on the way traveling with him, lest your accuser hand you over to the judge, and the judge to the guard, and you be put in prison.

26 Truly I say to you, you will not be released until you have paid the last fraction of a penny.  

Who do you think the judge is that the person will hand the other person over to? 

But my daughter took the higher road and reached out to this person right away -- not because this other person was offended, but because my daughter was and wanted to make things right.

I want to explain why my daughter was offended: 

My daughter works in a bakery at a grocery store, she works hard.  She is often lifting boxes that weigh 50# or more over her head, as well as working around a hot oven all day-winter or summer!  My son-in-law, her husband works at McDonalds, he has for years-and is now moving up in management.  He works hard too-long hours.  I am thankful that they both have a job, and they are both providing for each other in their life, working to pay off their home and pay for things and needs themselves and not taking handouts.  They are eligible for some, but don't take them (AND I am NOT saying that it is wrong to take help from the government-no, not at all-it is fine to do so if you need the help). They do not have a college education, so would be considered not a skilled worker.

Why put them -as well as other non skilled workers, workers who serve us-down? This is soo very wrong of a christian to do.  We have to be better folks!

And my daughter and her husband have provided a place for our other daughter to live for almost 4 years, as she attended school.  That too is sacrifice.  

 But this person, continued to be rude to my daughter.  

It reminds me of one time when my other daughter -who was at a former job she use to work at, a coffee place along the toll road, was told by a customer-

                            "you will never amount to anything if you keep working here..." 

My daughter was not allowed to respond back at all, but what she wanted to say was this:  "I sir, am working my way thru college, paying my own way-doing this as well as another job while I attend school full time.  I am using this money, how little I make- to pay my way so you -as a taxpayer, do not have to pay my way on grants etc." 

See, you never know about a person!  This daughter is now a teacher by the way!  

Here is what I think about 'unskilled labor' as this person called them:

The person is AT LEAST working

providing income for their family

and I remember that they are made in GODs image and are one of HIS children (we are all HIS children, just some have turned away from HIM and those folks -if you who are a believer-you need to be more loving and kind -representing the SAVIOR to them)  ---SO be KIND!

What I learned from all of this is sometimes believers are the worse to work with.  And that folks---is WRONG.  

I am saddened this week by all of this. The first time this happened this week, I worked with someone online with a different opinion, they were willing to allow the different opinions to be posted on their page, allow scripture that I shared to back my view to remain on their page, and they were very respectful.  That person is not a believer (as I believe).

  The other-who claims to be a believer-was rude, kept taking down the scriptures -censoring things others were saying- including scripture! 

This is one reason why some who do not believe about YHWH do not want to hear about HIM from us or the good news we have to share about YHWH and what HIS SON has done for us!  With social media, they see it this type of behavior more often and it really turns them off!

We as believers need to be better than this, if in fact we are spouting off on a social media site, yes on your own page-but still public---and you do throw up all over everyone in the process ---then be willing to help clean it up and not become a hard hearted person.

Oh I am sure now that this person will 'de-friend me' and really, I do not care.  

My daughter was offended.  

My daughter (as well as a few other people) were hurt and offended.  

As a believer this person has a responsibility, but has failed. 

I do not share this to point out one person, or persons, but to show and compare the reaction of non-believers and believers and to show that it is sad that the non-believer in the first post (original post about abortion) did far better than the believer.  We believers need to do better folks. 

And for the record:  I believe like scripture shows us: we are to pay a fair wage to workers for a day of work.  AND we are to pay enough to allow them to make a living with the cost of living around here. (that means different mcdonalds may pay different wages depending on which area of the country they are in)

Tipping is important too-I tip at 10% for average service, and at 15-20 or even 30% or more for better to wonderful service.  Why?  Not because I am made of money, or because I want to say: hey look at me! How wonderful I am and I can pay and tip a lot! I tip because I want to show respect and appreciation for those who do a good job.  It is the right thing to do.
So is paying a person a fair wage, and that folks-includes McDonald workers.  

 Proverbs 14:31
“No one can serve two masters. Either he will hate the one and love the other, or he will be devoted to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve both God and money.”

“He who oppresses the poor shows contempt for their Maker, but whoever is kind to the needy honors God.”
Matthew 6:24